Magic Bikes!

[Craig Knight]

which bikes were your best and what made them that way?

[jack thompson]

My first Honda Cr125 updated me from ultra squid to a regular squid.magic if everyone else in 1974 didnt have one also

[roger p]

That's easy... by far the best enduro bike are my 420 Husky automatics - always in the right gear in the nasty, gnarly single track rides and it's incredible off the line - 1/3 throttle with full brakes... green flag and you fly off the line like no other. Last year X Husky factory rider Terry Cunningham rode an enduro on his old auto and loved it!

[Joe Joiner]

This is going to be easy,if we are talking about race bikes,which I assume we are.I wanted to start riding motocross about April-May 68,so my comparisons are going to be in that time frame.250 CZ hands down. It handled so much better( to me anyway) than anything else available at that time.The rear end bounced from side to side a bit, but if you just relaxed a bit and let the bike "have it's way" and didn't try to fight it,it would somehow miraculeously stay pointed exactly where you wanted it to go. The front forks were way ahead of their time with about 7" of travel.Damping was excellent. It was plenty fast enough to run with the best of the best, but the best part was its' broad,predictable power band.This made it very easy to ride and confidence inspiring, for you knew it was never going to surprise you with a wild or harsh power delivery. Riding it in slimy,slick mud (which was always my favorite racing conditions) .was like cheating. And the silky smooth gear box was virtually in-destructable.Bear in mind that these were the days of "hand on the helmet " starts.You could rev the motor fairly high(but not too high) slam the lever into gear, grab the handlebar,never touching the clutch,and rocket off the line! CZs were very seldom beat into the first turn.You could do this week after week with absolutely NO gear box problems. They were bullet proof! Made from the highest quality steel with evidently the very best heat treating known in their day. The frames were also 4130 chrome-moly steel. Pretty amazing, considering that they were made in a more or less 3rd world Communist country,Czeckoslavakia. Truly a world class racing machine available,for a very short period of time to the general public. The 2 pipe 1968 CZ 250 motocrosser. What a classic!

[David Maclaskey]

1983 Honda CR480. That bike would lay over in a turn like a 125.

[David Maclaskey]

roger p said:

That's easy... by far the best enduro bike are my 420 Husky automatics - always in the right gear in the nasty, gnarly single track rides and it's incredible off the line - 1/3 throttle with full brakes... green flag and you fly off the line like no other. Last year X Husky factory rider Terry Cunningham rode an enduro on his old auto and loved it!

James Gibbs had a few of those autos. He let me MX on them. That was a blast.

[jack thompson]

I hate to be redundant, but there is no better bike than a Penton 6day 125.JT

[Joe Joiner]

I guess that I gotta mention the 71-72 Honda SL125 here too for they were so good to me. Funny how a puny little street/trail bike could be so competetive with high dollar European machinery. But it wasn't easy. Couldn't just buy one and go race. Had to strip, modify,lighten,change tires,re-wire,different cam, ported head, pipe,enlarged carb(done on a milling machine) and extensive air box mods. A set of Konis on the rear and some damper rod hole drilling in the front forks, and they were ready to race. We're talking local cross country racing here. The Pentons and Monarks ruled motocross at the time. But on a tight, twisty cross country track, they were very difficult to beat. A rather short(By MX standards 56 or 57") 52' wheelbase helped and a very smooth,predictable power band was perfect for tight trees and running down thru and across creeks etc. In the mud they were unbeatable. In typical Honda fashion, they NEVER broke, amazing considering that they still had a battery ignition, rectifier etc. Man I loved riding those little 4 strokes. Even took them to the California Desert 3 years and rode them in the famous "Barstow to Vegas" 170 mile desert race with good results. They were a little short wheelbase for real desert racing, but they were all we had . God I loved those little bikes. I'm building a 72 model right now. Maybe trail ride it a little.

[Paul Burnett]

In 90' I went to Livermore,Ca for Dick Mann's AHRMA race and someone had a titanium frame for the SL100/125 they claimed was Preston Petty's for $350. With my high business accumen I declined thinking no 4T will be competitive with the Elsie and not taking into account I had just spent that much for titanium parts for a mountain bike that fit in the palm of my hand.
Joe, I think one of my mechanics when I was SM at Honda North still had a SL you built for his dad he was trying to resurrect.
when I was on Hodaka's I remember Duncan Paul had a fast 100 and Rocky Miller would always holeshot us later confessing it had been stroked. I think I remember Duncan saying he used a CB175 piston?

[Paul Burnett]

Does anyone have any contact with the old AMP people(Houston?)? Some west coast guys are trying to build a killer CZ 125 and are looking for engine specs or cylinders. Steve Wise, didn’t you ride one a few times?

[Joe Joiner]

Paul, raising the EX port about 3mm (.120 in ) will help for a start. Maybe 4mm if more top end is needed. Not really necessary to use a degree wheel, but if someone wanted to do it that way, about 170 degrees of ex timing will help it have a better big end hit. Needs a pipe to match the timing too. 34 or 36 mm carb should be more than enough, and with a GEM or somebody's reed valve setup. The combustion chamber needs to be welded up and re-shaped to give it a higher static C.R. , especially if the ex port is raised much. Transfers should be OK at their stock height, but if somebody wants to make a real screamer out of one, then raise them also .020 to .040. Lots of other things can be done with an iron liner. Capillary by-pass ports, breathing thru holes cut in the piston etc. but it takes a lot of time and money to have all that stuff done. Can't remember if the 125CZ was a single or bridged EX port.In either case, widening the EX port at the tops (ala early Elsinore, and all late 2 strokes) will help too, but caution must be used to not go too wide so that the rings hang in the port. Any way you could 'stuff ' the crankshaft balancing holes would help too, but that too gets expensive. I bet Lucky would have a few ideas. Joe Gilbert might have done a few back in the day too. Might check with them.

[Joe Joiner]

Joe Joiner said:

Paul, raising the EX port about 3mm (.120 in ) will help for a start. Maybe 4mm if more top end is needed. Not really necessary to use a degree wheel, but if someone wanted to do it that way, about 170 degrees of ex timing will help it have a better big end hit. Needs a pipe to match the timing too. 34 or 36 mm carb should be more than enough, and with a GEM or somebody's reed valve setup. The combustion chamber needs to be welded up and re-shaped to give it a higher static C.R. , especially if the ex port is raised much. Transfers should be OK at their stock height, but if somebody wants to make a real screamer out of one, then raise them also .020 to .040. Lots of other things can be done with an iron liner. Capillary by-pass ports, breathing thru holes cut in the piston etc. but it takes a lot of time and money to have all that stuff done. Can't remember if the 125CZ was a single or bridged EX port.In either case, widening the EX port at the tops (ala early Elsinore, and all late 2 strokes) will help too, but caution must be used to not go too wide so that the rings hang in the port. Any way you could 'stuff ' the crankshaft balancing holes would help too, but that too gets expensive. I bet Lucky would have a few ideas. Joe Gilbert might have done a few back in the day too. Might check with them.

[Joe Joiner]

Joe Joiner said:

Joe Joiner said:

Paul, raising the EX port about 3mm (.120 in ) will help for a start. Maybe 4mm if more top end is needed. Not really necessary to use a degree wheel, but if someone wanted to do it that way, about 170 degrees of ex timing will help it have a better big end hit. Needs a pipe to match the timing too. 34 or 36 mm carb should be more than enough, and with a GEM or somebody's reed valve setup. The combustion chamber needs to be welded up and re-shaped to give it a higher static C.R. , especially if the ex port is raised much. Transfers should be OK at their stock height, but if somebody wants to make a real screamer out of one, then raise them also .020 to .040. Lots of other things can be done with an iron liner. Capillary by-pass ports, breathing thru holes cut in the piston etc. but it takes a lot of time and money to have all that stuff done. Can't remember if the 125CZ was a single or bridged EX port.In either case, widening the EX port at the tops (ala early Elsinore, and all late 2 strokes) will help too, but caution must be used to not go too wide so that the rings hang in the port. Any way you could 'stuff ' the crankshaft balancing holes would help too, but that too gets expensive. I bet Lucky would have a few ideas. Joe Gilbert might have done a few back in the day too. Might check with them.